Could the Goths have survived?

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The same people that help caused the Roman Empire to collapse and create lasting influential effects… All seem to not exist as a modern day ethic group of people, what caused this? Why did they seemingly quickly assimilate into Roman culture. Could they have settled en mass in the balkans and create a hypothetical "Gutland" in modern day Bulgaria or Macedonia, in this post we'll explore this timeline!


admin

2 months ago (edited by admin 2 months ago) Administrator

I would argue that the Goths assimilated into Roman culture because they were Romanized (brought under the influence of the expanding Roman culture) because of trade, military campaigns and the political sphere of influence that focused on the Empire. Tacitus' Germania described the Germanic people around or near the early 1st century in great detail, and made clear that Germans living in the heart of Germania were still very 'barbarian,' but the Germans living near the cities established around the Rhine were heavily Roman in nature. So, by the time the Roman Empire fell into disarray during the 3rd century, many of the people calling themselves Goths were speaking vulgar Latin and practicing Roman law.

The rule of Theoderic the Great is an interesting case of how a people once considered the enemy of a culture became its practitioners. The 'Ostrogothic Kingdom' is a name given to his kingdom by historians, and it was a continuation of the Roman Empire under the rule of another dynasty in every way except for the people who ruled over it.

If there was a 'Gutland' that kept to its boundaries, instead of forging alliances with Roman emperors that eventually lead to the settlement of various Goths around Aquitania, things would have played out differently… but I still think the Roman Empire would have fallen into collapse. It was already on the verge of collapse throughout the Valentinian dynasty for political and economic reasons. Remember that the Roman denarius (their currency) was once nearly pure silver (~97%) and had fallen to <3% silver with the antoninianus, the currency used by Romans during the 3rd century. See how history repeats itself?


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I would argue that the Goths assimilated into Roman culture because they were Romanized (brought under the influence of the expanding Roman culture) because of trade, military campaigns and the political sphere of influence that focused on the Empire. Tacitus' Germania described the Germanic people around or near the early 1st century in great detail, and made clear that Germans living in the heart of Germania were still very 'barbarian,' but the Germans living near the cities established around the Rhine were heavily Roman in nature. So, by the time the Roman Empire fell into disarray during the 3rd century, many of the people calling themselves Goths were speaking vulgar Latin and practicing Roman law.

The rule of Theoderic the Great is an interesting case of how a people once considered the enemy of a culture became its practitioners. The 'Ostrogothic Kingdom' is a name given to his kingdom by historians, and it was a continuation of the Roman Empire under the rule of another dynasty in every way except for the people who ruled over it.

If there was a 'Gutland' that kept to its boundaries, instead of forging alliances with Roman emperors that eventually lead to the settlement of various Goths around Aquitania, things would have played out differently… but I still think the Roman Empire would have fallen into collapse. It was already on the verge of collapse throughout the Valentinian dynasty for political and economic reasons. Remember that the Roman denarius (their currency) was once nearly pure silver (~97%) and had fallen to <3% silver with the antoninianus, the currency used by Romans during the 3rd century. See how history repeats itself?

I'm curious then, how would it be possible to create a Oder–Vistula (Eastern Germanic) speaking region? Say in Northern Bulgaria or Crimea, as there was goths in Crimea in our timeline. I would actually if you don't mind change what tribes migrate to different places. Though this would create butterfly effects later on, I would just ignore them for now just so this doesn't become a mess.

I would say could we have instead a large amount of goths migrating to the Garonne river, we could move them to the Danube. Around 376 and 382, we could have them settle as that's when they raid Adrianople. I could also see more of the "wilder" tribes from the north that were less Romanized join under the "Gothic" name. Such as the Vandals, Ligians, Lemovians, Rugii, ect. replenish some of the barbarian nature and culture of the Goths. The Alans can join if you also agree on that decision.


Could you elaborate on the goths? :)


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